tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post4196571238224716244..comments2024-03-09T03:49:50.699-05:00Comments on Your Critic is in Another Castle: The Age of the Dragons, part II: The Tragedie of KirkwalleK. Coxhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06554183349391372039noreply@blogger.comBlogger51125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-64712688051509203272012-07-16T18:25:05.067-04:002012-07-16T18:25:05.067-04:00Heh, as a programmer myself, I know the first rele...Heh, as a programmer myself, I know the first release of ANY product is never truly "complete"... so I like to wait on purchases to give them time to fix the obvious flaws. And I'm also a cheapskate and I like getting things on sale. :)Friar Bobnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-8144326037454713482012-07-16T18:22:22.724-04:002012-07-16T18:22:22.724-04:00OK, maybe I'm just weird, but I think it's...OK, maybe I'm just weird, but I think it's more a mercy to let Anders not actually SEE his death coming. They don't offer blindfolds to the victims of a firing squad to INCREASE their fear of death, after all. And it wasn't like it was unexpected or undeserved or anything remotely like that. Anders knew what he did was wrong, knew it was inexcusable and unforgivable, and chose to do it anyway. He knew full well he deserved to die. To me, in order to have the negative connotation of "a backstabbing son-of-a-bitch" (or daughter-of...) actually apply you have to stab somebody UNDESERVEDLY *and* UNEXPECTEDLY. Neither of those applies in this case.<br /><br />I agree with Anders that the Chantry system (the circles, and more) all needed to change (badly), but as soon as Marian Hawke got her romantic achievement I went back and executed that slimebucket and never looked back. (Pity Varic doesn't account for that in the epilogue tho.)Friar Bobnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-43465719344071463532012-01-18T20:39:10.995-05:002012-01-18T20:39:10.995-05:00Just a brief return to say that Flutiebear's l...Just a brief return to say that Flutiebear's link was, indeed, great stuff. I was pretty hip to the concept of tragedy through various lit classes, but had never heard of the heroine's journey.<br /><br />It goes a long way toward explaining why so many women love DA2.Beth N.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-50072562237357787842012-01-17T10:47:10.254-05:002012-01-17T10:47:10.254-05:00Ahh cool, tone is always a tricky bugger to pick u...Ahh cool, tone is always a tricky bugger to pick up online :) There's a cheap stereotype of US culture being unable to cope with sad endings in Europe (or film execs being convinced they can't), something The Descent's new ending didn't help with unfortunately!Furtlednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-7383533969459872012012-01-17T10:34:24.449-05:002012-01-17T10:34:24.449-05:00I didn't take it as a slight, I'm just an ...I didn't take it as a slight, I'm just an observer of US culture, and know little about the zeitgeist in Europe. I'm sure there's overlap, but I'm not really confident in extrapolating.DoctorJaynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-31954583522922925852012-01-17T07:33:01.214-05:002012-01-17T07:33:01.214-05:00Ah it wasn't intended as a slight on the US or...Ah it wasn't intended as a slight on the US or anything like that, they're mainly European films because that's where I'm based :) On the subject of plausibility I tend to take it from the responses of the people involved rather than the framework of their interactions; so the actions of people in Dawn of the Dead are just as plausible as the actions of say, Lear.<br /><br />Completely agree that classic tragedy isn't a big thing in popular cinema right now, but it was the same during the last major recession/depression, I would argue there's a fair amount of tragic films (more modern tragic than classic) out there beyond Kane; even something as ridiculous as Ghost Ship, The Fly or Titanic has most of the hallmarks of a classic tragedy (but you're right - not all of them). <br /><br />And No Country for Old Men is (imo obv.) superb and really worth a look if you get the time; also the Mist is worth watching too as it's the one on that list that comes closest to being a 'classic' tragedy, there's actually a few similarities to Hawke's story now that I think about it.Furtlednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-83477565141100166792012-01-13T12:25:39.928-05:002012-01-13T12:25:39.928-05:00Well, I don't think it's fair to count a U...Well, I don't think it's fair to count a UK ending, I'm talking the USA here. Dawn of the Dead reminds me of Invasion of the Body Snatchers, as well. But I kind of think a good tragedy has to be plausible. You have to think, "Oh yeah, that could happen."<br /><br />Strangely, most of the rest I haven't seen, and with major regrets about No Country for Old Men.<br /><br />But you're kind of making my point when you say, "not classic tragedies as such".DoctorJaynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-67503130546083092462012-01-13T08:33:40.736-05:002012-01-13T08:33:40.736-05:00.rec, Pan's Labyrinth, Dawn of the Dead (both ....rec, Pan's Labyrinth, Dawn of the Dead (both versions), The Orphanage, Eden Lake, Paranormal Activity (original ending), The Descent (UK ending), The Mist (seriously bleak ending) and No Country for Old Men spring to mind; not classic tragedies as such (and arguably most of them are 'genre' films opposed to well known blockbusters) but depending on your reading they all end badly for the supposed protagonists.Furtlednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-18797673883422257142012-01-13T02:31:55.329-05:002012-01-13T02:31:55.329-05:00I felt the same way when I finally an a pro-Templa...I felt the same way when I finally an a pro-Templar Hawke through the game, Meredith's talks with pro-Templar Hawke added so much to her character, but without that extra depth she only ever comes across as an almost pantomime like villain.Furtlednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-33710778854270799222012-01-13T02:27:16.557-05:002012-01-13T02:27:16.557-05:00Oh sweet zombie jesus, I have almost unholy love o...Oh sweet zombie jesus, I have almost unholy love of Lear as a tragedy, hubris, madness and the ending when Lear comes to his senses with Cordelia, it's incredible.Furtlednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-92135292773259648012012-01-13T02:24:32.773-05:002012-01-13T02:24:32.773-05:00Thing is when Anders kills Karl it's face to f...Thing is when Anders kills Karl it's face to face, that's more the physical positioning I'd expect to see between two people in a relationship/former lovers; the standing behind just seems so off in that situation, even with the additional patched dialogue.Furtlednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-61844472619689820152012-01-12T23:06:24.373-05:002012-01-12T23:06:24.373-05:00I actually thought DA2 did a good job to not pick ...I actually thought DA2 did a good job to not pick a "real canon" story that "the game wants to tell." Of course you're going to find out more information when you make choices you hadn't made before.<br /><br />The best example of this that I can think of would be Meredith. On a pro-mage playthrough, that woman is just 150% crazy. But if the PC has a track-record of sympathizing with the Templars, then Meredith volunteers an actually quite compelling story behind her "Yes, I know most mages mean well, BUT..." mentality. Yet, I'm definitely getting the feeling that the spirit of DA leans towards pro-Mage (Asunder cemented that feeling). But pro-Magers don't get the aforementioned piece of (in my opinion) very illuminating information.Bonan Wanghttp://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=2005708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-65935110702505767752012-01-12T13:29:55.998-05:002012-01-12T13:29:55.998-05:00Aw, it's okay. Just thought I'd ask!Aw, it's okay. Just thought I'd ask!Cameronhttp://twitter.com/infernalserpentnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-29807078538619539602012-01-12T13:01:23.862-05:002012-01-12T13:01:23.862-05:00As a culture, we seem to have given up on tragedy....As a culture, we seem to have given up on tragedy. What's the last tragic film published? <i>Citizen Kane</i>?<br /><br />Hmm, I sort of think of the recent <i>Captain America</i> as a tragedy, that was slipped in while nobody was looking.DoctorJaynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-51880007784498303412012-01-12T12:58:29.113-05:002012-01-12T12:58:29.113-05:00Personally, I didn't like R&J much until I...Personally, I didn't like R&J much until I saw the Baz Lurhman version. I think that DiCaprio made Romeo feel enough like a depressive teenager that I believed he might well do something so colossally stupid as what he does. <br /><br />Still, I like that theory, too. <i>Macbeth</i> is good, but <i>King Lear</i> is even better. It's a bullet to the brain pan. DoctorJaynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-24628212136429061602012-01-12T12:05:50.110-05:002012-01-12T12:05:50.110-05:00I couldn't find it last night! This made me s...I couldn't find it last night! This made me sad. On the other hand I have a ludicrous number of DA2 screenshots at the moment so it might still be in there somewhere...K. Coxhttp://www.your-critic.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-33956547322339688072012-01-12T11:44:59.386-05:002012-01-12T11:44:59.386-05:00That would make a huge amount of sense, really. I...That would make a huge amount of sense, really. I like that theory.K. Coxhttp://www.your-critic.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-45760705335532868172012-01-12T11:44:29.271-05:002012-01-12T11:44:29.271-05:00If I'm being strictly honest? I picked Sophoc...If I'm being strictly honest? I picked Sophocles rather than a hundred other go-to examples of tragedy because it made the sentence sound nice. Had I known it would be a pull-quote on Kotaku, I might have chosen differently. ;)<br /><br />That said, I'm not making a statement on its quality for the ages there, but rather its general nature. I found the story to be a key example of a classic tragedy, and so that's what I compared it to. I do agree that the Orsino thing does come out of nowhere and was a very poor narrative choice to include in a pro-mage playthrough.<br /><br />As for Hawke and Anders not meaning anything though, I disagree. Well, no. Hawke <i>doesn't</i> mean anything, and that's something I addressed in the essay. But Anders's actions do spur further rebellions elsewhere. There's unrest with the Divine, the Chantry, and the Seekers as a result of Anders's actions, and the destruction of Kirkwall's Chantry is cited several times in the novel, by both mages and templars, as an instigating event in the Circles' withdrawal. In effect, Anders got the eventual outcome he wanted, at least as far as we know.K. Coxhttp://www.your-critic.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-40527082312695128112012-01-12T10:49:25.694-05:002012-01-12T10:49:25.694-05:00"Players went in to Dragon Age 2 expecting th..."Players went in to Dragon Age 2 expecting the arc of Star Wars and instead got handed something out of Sophocles." I have to respectfully disagree here. I found the narrative to be terrible, and no where near Sophocles. Mage antagonists are all insane and stupid, templar antagonists were sadists (and two of them were rapists). The narrative lead to Orsino becoming a Harvester for no real reason, and Meredith became possessed by a macuffin the same absurd reason -to provide a boss battle against a ludicrious villain.<br /> <br />In fact, Gaider's novel "Asunder" points out that Hawke and Anders' actions didn't mean anything - the mage revolution happened for reasons that had nothing to do with Kirkwall which, for me, makes Dragon Age II pointless.Michael Gonzaleznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-46237975133319234042012-01-11T21:10:49.962-05:002012-01-11T21:10:49.962-05:00Romeo and Juliet is horribly taught in 9th grade E...Romeo and Juliet is horribly taught in 9th grade English. There is a fantastic literary theory that Romeo and Juliet is actually a satire of the tragedy and Shakespeare was trolling over dramatic Italian drama of the time. That theory puts a new light on the play. Macbeth on the other hand...pure awesome.StrongStyleFictionnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-47944820945521421152012-01-11T18:30:22.704-05:002012-01-11T18:30:22.704-05:00Share!Share!Cameronhttp://twitter.com/infernalserpentnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-48961441570071851712012-01-11T17:42:11.959-05:002012-01-11T17:42:11.959-05:00Probably not worth a footnote, but yeah. I was pla...Probably not worth a footnote, but yeah. I was playing it from Day 1, and my most recent play-through last month was a <i>very</i> different experience.Cameronhttp://twitter.com/infernalserpentnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-2876188456331929232012-01-11T17:41:07.263-05:002012-01-11T17:41:07.263-05:00I managed, by sheer luck, to capture a gorgeous sc...I managed, by sheer luck, to capture a gorgeous screenshot of my rogue in mid-air, about to land knife-first on some undead thing. It is seriously badass; a moment out of <i>The Matrix</i> sitting happily on my hard drive.K. Coxhttp://www.your-critic.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-10857408375372312402012-01-11T17:38:07.753-05:002012-01-11T17:38:07.753-05:00That is something I should probably have noted som...That is something I should probably have noted somewhere: I played the fully patched (1.03, I think) PC version of the game, in November and December 2011. So there are some meaningful, negative ways in which early players and perhaps console players had a different experience than I did.K. Coxhttp://www.your-critic.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-886868484666652260.post-4609824580830090102012-01-11T17:36:08.933-05:002012-01-11T17:36:08.933-05:00That's been fixed in a patch. More romantic op...That's been fixed in a patch. More romantic options were supposed to show up in dialogue (and you can sway a rivalmanced Anders to side against the mages!), but there was a bug. They really needed more time on the project, alas.Cameronhttp://twitter.com/infernalserpentnoreply@blogger.com